(20/07/2012 20:21)Harryn9000 Wrote: [ -> ]i say decker are needed for 53 one busy route all the time except for night it ain't too bad then
I agree! The 53/53A have both been very busy recently; I never considered them to be "busy services" until the "Quality Bus Partnership" started.
Double-deckers are needed on most (if not, all) Liverpool services, in my opinion. For an ever-growing city like Liverpool, the amount of 'deckers that run into the city is poor (compared to places like of Manchester, anyway) - and it's not like they're not needed here because they really are! (This isn't directly aimed at SM&SL, by the way - ANW are just as bad.)
it worst at school time as the buses are standing load easily for a good hour at least morning and night
You can say you think/want deckers all you want. Doesn't change the fact that there aren't any and the numbers/loadings/profits aren't there to justify them anyway.
Time to move on I think.
(20/07/2012 20:31)27701 Wrote: [ -> ] (20/07/2012 20:21)Harryn9000 Wrote: [ -> ]i say decker are needed for 53 one busy route all the time except for night it ain't too bad then
I agree! The 53/53A have both been very busy recently; I never considered them to be "busy services" until the "Quality Bus Partnership" started.
Double-deckers are needed on most (if not, all) Liverpool services, in my opinion. For an ever-growing city like Liverpool, the amount of 'deckers that run into the city is poor (compared to places like of Manchester, anyway) - and it's not like they're not needed here because they really are! (This isn't directly aimed at SM&SL, by the way - ANW are just as bad.)
It's funny to think that we used to be a predominately decker city with the singles in the minority, the thing is the singles are cheaper to run and therefore yield more profit and if they are full bus company bosses are happy regardless if people have a seat or not. The 53 is an interesting one with regards to deckers as there are times when you would certainly say yes it does require deckers but bus company bosses will point to the frequency of the service and just say if a bus is full it won't be long to another even though we know a lot of the time there is bunching. The issue of deckers is one we have been over several times before on the forum so I will say no more on that matter.
I wouldn't say that bosses are happy with over-full buses.
Yes, on the one hand its great that loadings are good and (hopefully) the route is making money, but corporate image is important and standing tends not to help that. If vehicles are regularly absolutely full, managers will be questioning how much custom/profit they are missing out on by not having bigger vehicles on.
I see someone mentioned a notice on 27717 earlier up the page - I think this was applied sporadically to some vehicles going to London, but by no means all.
(20/07/2012 21:22)mbonwick Wrote: [ -> ]I wouldn't say that bosses are happy with over-full buses.
Yes, on the one hand its great that loadings are good and (hopefully) the route is making money, but corporate image is important and standing tends not to help that. If vehicles are regularly absolutely full, managers will be questioning how much custom/profit they are missing out on by not having bigger vehicles on.
I see someone mentioned a notice on 27717 earlier up the page - I think this was applied sporadically to some vehicles going to London, but by no means all.
It was me that mentioned that on 27717, with regards to business well we know profit is king don't we but I understand what you mean with corporate image as well.
each bus thats in service and due to go to london have that sign plus the ones here to cover buses thats gone to london (apart from the renowns) have a sign saying this a replacment bus bla bla bla
I was trying to get at how people see bus companies.
Although you're right that profit is the main driving force, companies want customers to come away with a positive experience of their journey - ie. thinking "OK, that wasn't so bad, I would do it again".
Clearly a packed bus does not send that image.
Another example is that of Stagecoach Gold. Although the primary objective is to get more people on the bus, it tries to do that by getting them to see the bus as more luxurious - ie. a positive experience.
I know you were trying to get at how people see bus companies, people will put up with a packed bus every now and then but not all the time and I am no exception to that, I also know that people will want a positive experience of what they do to do it again, I know that from a former employment and whilst it as a completely different type of business the principal is the same. Problem with Liverpool is that the big companies all set their stall out when the majority of their fleets became single deckers so regardless of whether deckers are required it will be quite a big job to sort it all out quickly and in all honesty they probably don't see the need.
The thing is they employ singles and high frequencies on routes to compensate for lack of deckers. ie 20/21 10 etc The problem there is bunching. One bus can not turn up on time and result in a massive influx of passengers at one given time resulting in buses either being over crowded or nearly empty. The 17/19 must evidently warrant the deckers during non term time otherwise why are they on there? I fail to see how you can end all on if they were needed they would be there. Look at the 79 for Arriva. For YEARS they were needed and Arriva tried everything to a point were there was a bus every 3 minutes in some cases before they admitted "defeat" and employed deckers. Now I am not saying what mbonwick has said is completely wrong obviously certain routes don't warrant them and thus don't get them. But I do feel some routes are overlooked and in my OPINION are poorly operated and that aint just Stagecoach its Arriva too.