(04/09/2012 20:09)MPTE1955 Wrote: [ -> ]it's only us enthusiasts that care about the QBP. Fact is that somebody with a wheelchair could still get on the B10L, and as said the bus is still low floor.
I'd completely disagree; every passenger can read the notices on bus stops promising certain standards. Obviously it's down to the pitiful Merseytravel to enforce theses standard but it's the operators who should be keeping them up. For the record though, I do agree that a bus is better than no bus at all. With regards wheelchair accessibility, that's pretty much an obsolete point now as both Gilmoss and St Helens are fully low floor.
(04/09/2012 20:12)mbonwick Wrote: [ -> ]How do you know the engineers don't want the Enviro300s back for maintainence? How do you know some aren't due in for milage based work and are on restricted diagrams?
I don't know that for definite. However, I'd be surprised if every vehicle on those early finishing boards are going straight in for maintenance.
(04/09/2012 20:12)mbonwick Wrote: [ -> ]It also causes hassle at the end of the day when the duty sheets printed for the vehicles have to be amended and uploaded back on to the computer system for future references. At the best of times there's a lot of work in that, so swapping vehicles just to please a few spotters definitely isn't on the list of priorities.
It's not the PX55 Darts I particularly have an issue with but when you have R reg vehicles (and yes, a single one at that) staying out onto lates, would it really be that much work to swap that one vehicle? At the end of the day, regardless of the amount of work it may create, that's work someone's being paid to complete. As for it to be just to please spotters, that's not what I'm inferring at all. Joe Blogs can tell a new bus from an old bus and when they're being promised new buses in QBP propaganda, it's what they should really be getting and the operator has an obligation to provide that. Are we suggesting that everything newer than an R reg coming in off of a 10A in the early evening is doing so for maintenance? Like I said in reply to MPTE above though, I agree a bus is better than no bus.
(04/09/2012 20:12)mbonwick Wrote: [ -> ]Yes, if possible the older vehicles would ideally be on the early finish diagrams, but at the end of the day in terms of features they're no different to the Enviro300s and are perfectly fit for purpose.
Fit for purpose on any service? With the supposed age restrictions and emissions standards employed on these QBPs, I'd disagree.
I agree its unlikely that *all* the Enviro300s are in need of maintainence.
It may well only be 1 vehicle, but you don't know how many swaps there have been during the day between the boards. If its been a quiet day then really there isn't much excuse, but if its been a busy one..... Either way its extra unrequired work.
Yes the vehicles are fit for purpose. What does an Enviro300 provide that a B10L/BLE doesn't?
the Enviro300 meets the correct QBP standards and the liberators dont (correct me if wrong)
(04/09/2012 22:06)mbonwick Wrote: [ -> ]Yes the vehicles are fit for purpose. What does an Enviro300 provide that a B10L/BLE doesn't?
(04/09/2012 21:44)CX54 DKD Wrote: [ -> ]With the supposed age restrictions and emissions standards employed on these QBPs, I'd disagree.
An Enviro300 is compliant with the, admittedly laughable, QBPs. A B10L/BLE falls short of age and emissions standards promised by the operation of QBPs. Ridiculously minor? Maybe, but it's true.
True and minor it is.
Under normal circumstances I would agree with you that its unacceptable, but we do have the Paralympics on. Don't be surprised if GM are expected to have some Enviro300s ready to go at short notice if required.
Come next Tuesday there'll be no excuse.
(04/09/2012 21:44)CX54 DKD Wrote: [ -> ] (04/09/2012 20:09)MPTE1955 Wrote: [ -> ]it's only us enthusiasts that care about the QBP. Fact is that somebody with a wheelchair could still get on the B10L, and as said the bus is still low floor.
I'd completely disagree; every passenger can read the notices on bus stops promising certain standards. Obviously it's down to the pitiful Merseytravel to enforce theses standard but it's the operators who should be keeping them up. For the record though, I do agree that a bus is better than no bus at all. With regards wheelchair accessibility, that's pretty much an obsolete point now as both Gilmoss and St Helens are fully low floor.
(04/09/2012 20:12)mbonwick Wrote: [ -> ]How do you know the engineers don't want the Enviro300s back for maintainence? How do you know some aren't due in for milage based work and are on restricted diagrams?
I don't know that for definite. However, I'd be surprised if every vehicle on those early finishing boards are going straight in for maintenance.
(04/09/2012 20:12)mbonwick Wrote: [ -> ]It also causes hassle at the end of the day when the duty sheets printed for the vehicles have to be amended and uploaded back on to the computer system for future references. At the best of times there's a lot of work in that, so swapping vehicles just to please a few spotters definitely isn't on the list of priorities.
It's not the PX55 Darts I particularly have an issue with but when you have R reg vehicles (and yes, a single one at that) staying out onto lates, would it really be that much work to swap that one vehicle? At the end of the day, regardless of the amount of work it may create, that's work someone's being paid to complete. As for it to be just to please spotters, that's not what I'm inferring at all. Joe Blogs can tell a new bus from an old bus and when they're being promised new buses in QBP propaganda, it's what they should really be getting and the operator has an obligation to provide that. Are we suggesting that everything newer than an R reg coming in off of a 10A in the early evening is doing so for maintenance? Like I said in reply to MPTE above though, I agree a bus is better than no bus.
(04/09/2012 20:12)mbonwick Wrote: [ -> ]Yes, if possible the older vehicles would ideally be on the early finish diagrams, but at the end of the day in terms of features they're no different to the Enviro300s and are perfectly fit for purpose.
Fit for purpose on any service? With the supposed age restrictions and emissions standards employed on these QBPs, I'd disagree.
I wouldnt say that wheel chair access was an obsolete point and I am more than aware that Gillmoss is all low floor and has been for some time. However you are making a big fuss about one vehicle, yes one vehicle probably for the one and only time. As Mbonwick said when all buses are back there will be no excuse. funny thing is you said in an earlier posting that you werent making a big deal out of it but well I would now say that you were, but if this was a regular occurence I would probably agree with you but one occasion I wouldnt waste my time.
(04/09/2012 22:13)mbonwick Wrote: [ -> ]Come next Tuesday there'll be no excuse.
Looks like the ex-CMT Volvo B10L/Liberators, B10BLE/Renowns and DartSLF/Crusaders are about to go then?
Get your last rides while there's still time....
I would imagine that the B10Ls will be disposed of, almost certainly. I'm less sure about the Crusader darts, but given the condition of those transferred to Midlands, I would say its likely. The Spytes will be going without doubt.
I would hope that the B10BLEs manage to stay with Stagecoach though, just not on Merseyside - they'd be excellent as a stop gap measure if Rock Ferry is aquired as rumours suggest.