Halton Transport

[Valandil]

RE: Halton Transport

(17/06/2012 16:04)K853 MTJ Wrote:  Not happy about the 12 going, I like that route :P Alternative way to get home, always has decent buses on as well when I get it!
Fingers crossed the above turns out to be true apart from that though, interesting times!
Personally for the new buses I'd think that assuming all of them are brand new, they'd be Enviros (8.8ms for minis and Enviro 400s, most likely Tridents for deckers).
If they are new deckers, I wonder what service they would be for, because I think schools is out of the question for brand new vehicles! If they aren't new, what are they going to be?
a lot of questions to be asked as Steve says!

Lol, I remember having this discussion with you about the 12 on the old forum ... never did see the point in it!

Which routes can the deckers physically go on? -- it's anything but the 62, right?
If so, maybe some of the Liverpool peak running boards will have them allocated.

Minibuses ... hmm ... 26? ... Really can't think what the strategy might be on these.

Very glad to hear about the new livery; if they make as good a job as Network Warrington did in the rebrand, then Halton will become awesome.

[K853 MTJ]

RE: Halton Transport
No, there isn't a point to it, I agree there mate :P Its just a nice route to go on now and again, its longer than the 14 which with a good bus is all the better, its quieter, and covers a wider area. Pointless though, I do agree.
Wrong, cant go on the 61 either because of the busway.
Personally I reckon they should go on the 14s. At peak times these can get very busy and Deckers on certain duties would benefit it massively!

26, arguably the 17A, 2 if it does indeed go to the hive as theres no way an SPD is going to turn around down there without doing a 3 point turn!

[Valandil]

RE: Halton Transport

(17/06/2012 16:43)K853 MTJ Wrote:  26, arguably the 17A, 2 if it does indeed go to the hive as theres no way an SPD is going to turn around down there without doing a 3 point turn!

Warning: this post is 100% speculation, and of no actual use to anybody.

I guess you could probably get all the custom for the 2 onto smaller vehicles.
Due to being in a completely different part of the country, I'm not really sure what's going on with the retail park: is it finished yet, and the 26 serving there?
If that service would need to do a 3-point turn in the park too (which is really bad planning -- surely they could squeeze space for a turning circle!) then it would also have to be a mini, from what you suggest.
So then we'd need at least 5 vehicles: four on the 2, one on the 26.
And they'd surely need at least one backup vehicle too (like Warrington, which needs 5 Solos, but has 6, one being for backup).
Which doesn't fit with the info that there will be 4.

Maaaaybe the 4 minis are for the 2, and they might be able to get the shorter dart they have on the 26 to do the 3-point turn?

On a related point, I wonder whether they'll still be doing the 14c, or having a proper service 2 on Sundays in future.

[K853 MTJ]

RE: Halton Transport

(17/06/2012 17:17)Valandil Wrote:  

(17/06/2012 16:43)K853 MTJ Wrote:  26, arguably the 17A, 2 if it does indeed go to the hive as theres no way an SPD is going to turn around down there without doing a 3 point turn!

Warning: this post is 100% speculation, and of no actual use to anybody.

I guess you could probably get all the custom for the 2 onto smaller vehicles.
Due to being in a completely different part of the country, I'm not really sure what's going on with the retail park: is it finished yet, and the 26 serving there?
If that service would need to do a 3-point turn in the park too (which is really bad planning -- surely they could squeeze space for a turning circle!) then it would also have to be a mini, from what you suggest.
So then we'd need at least 5 vehicles: four on the 2, one on the 26.
And they'd surely need at least one backup vehicle too (like Warrington, which needs 5 Solos, but has 6, one being for backup).

On a related point, I wonder whether they'll still be doing the 14c, or having a proper service 2 on Sundays in future.

At peak times in may possibly be a squeeze, but an extra journey or two working off schools should cover it ok.
The 26 serves the new Tesco, with the 13 (Run by Widnes Commercial Motors) serving the hive. WCMs largest vehicle that has been used is an Optare Solo M880. Although its normally run by a Bluebird minibus. The layout down there is simple enough, a road going into the main park, with a car park to the left for Brewers Fayre and Premier Inn, and one to the right for everything else. To turn left or right you use a small roundabout (I say roundabout, its one of those slightly raised concrete things on the floor). Thats where the service turns around and parks up at the stop it passes on the right going towards the roundabout.
An SPD turning there is out of the question IMO, an MCV might just fit with a great deal of skill, praying and blind luck. The Bluebird turns around with ease, so an 8.8m Enviro would be able to negotiate it rather easily.

This is assuming that the minibuses go onto the 2. It may be a lot easier to get bigger buses around there in practice, having only seen it properly 2 or 3 times, its hard to gauge it properly relative to the bus itself.
The 17A doesn't need an SPD really, and the 26 still uses bus 20 (Although an SPD is commonplace on there now).
Personally, I'd say a 9.8m Enviro would be just about perfect seeing as this is the smallest length available with a decent 6 cylinder engine!

[Valandil]

RE: Halton Transport

(17/06/2012 17:31)K853 MTJ Wrote:  At peak times in may possibly be a squeeze, but an extra journey or two working off schools should cover it ok.
The 26 serves the new Tesco, with the 13 (Run by Widnes Commercial Motors) serving the hive. WCMs largest vehicle that has been used is an Optare Solo M880. Although its normally run by a Bluebird minibus. The layout down there is simple enough, a road going into the main park, with a car park to the left for Brewers Fayre and Premier Inn, and one to the right for everything else. To turn left or right you use a small roundabout (I say roundabout, its one of those slightly raised concrete things on the floor). Thats where the service turns around and parks up at the stop it passes on the right going towards the roundabout.
An SPD turning there is out of the question IMO, an MCV might just fit with a great deal of skill, praying and blind luck. The Bluebird turns around with ease, so an 8.8m Enviro would be able to negotiate it rather easily.

This is assuming that the minibuses go onto the 2. It may be a lot easier to get bigger buses around there in practice, having only seen it properly 2 or 3 times, its hard to gauge it properly relative to the bus itself.
The 17A doesn't need an SPD really, and the 26 still uses bus 20 (Although an SPD is commonplace on there now).
Personally, I'd say a 9.8m Enviro would be just about perfect seeing as this is the smallest length available with a decent 6 cylinder engine!

Oh I see: I assumed the Tesco was a part of the retail park.
Yep, I know 'The Hive' in that case: the 13's been serving there for ages, right? (Or is it 13a?)
So the 2 just means to get Halton in on that part of the town centre -- good move, if they can ensure that the 2's won't get behind time.
By my calculation, they'll have in theory 13 mins to do the extra leg (assuming still just 1 off at Halebank turning circle), which sounds like a lot, but when you factor in the time taken to drop people off by the market, navigate the traffic lights, zip around the retail park, and get back, there might not be very much time to spare ... and any delay will just accumulate throughout the day, since it looks like there's little opportunity to reclaim lost time.
I wouldn't be nearly so pessimistic, but every time I've tried to catch the 2 or 12 in the past, they've not been anywhere near on time, despite theoretically having 11 mins off in Widnes every hour.

If you're right about only minis getting around there, they won't have the flexibility to sub in covering vehicles as well ... not that this is the type of thing that Halton ever does anyway!

[ex d.river]

RE: Halton Transport
how on earth do you find out what is happening so quick .... please pray tell me !!!

[K853 MTJ]

RE: Halton Transport
No mate, its on the site of the old B&Q on Lugsdale Road
I think its the 13A now that you mention it mate! The 13 serves the Cherry Sutton end! All rather confusing!
Yeah, its always gone down that way, round the back of the new B&Q and come back out by The Toby Carvery (Bowers Park), but now I think it just goes straight into the hive and back again
It is really, was only a matter of time such a big part of the town was left rather abandoned by Halton. I don't care to get the 13A, so I just walk instead. But it can be very dangerous at busy times with there being a dual carriageway to get across. Should definetly be a connecting bridge from Tescos! The only thing now is that Halebank will now be completely unconnected directly to Widnes Vicarage Road by Halton services. Personally I think the 2 should be something like:
00 to The Hive
15 to Widnes Vicarage Road
30 to The Hive
45 to Widnes Vicarage Road
That way everywhere is covered as before just at a slightly reduced frequency as far as that end of town is concerned. I wonder if the 2 will go via Tescos to the Hive, in that they whizz in there, turn around and go back down to the roundabouts to The Hive.
It can be unreliable at times, the 12 often actually missing journeys from my experience, however since the recent timetable changes with the combined frequency being upped to every 15 minutes, this seems to be less of a regular occurrence. The unreliability does puzzle me though because as you say they do have a decent layover down at Widnes, and when I used to walk from school to get the 12 home from Vicarage Road, every 2/12 that came in always had decent layover time, but they often left like 5 mins late. I never did get that!

[Metroline1511]

RE: Halton Transport
It will be quite a departure for Halton to order some double-deckers. Maybe they should work route 14 now that Arriva have upgraded similar route 79 to double-deck.

[DVL418]

RE: Halton Transport

(17/06/2012 14:35)bolton bus basher Wrote:  sounds like haltons money problems have been sorted out then as if it was not they would not been getting more buses :P

What 'money problems'??

As a local authority bus company Halton Transport MUST operate at a profit and pay a % of the profit over to the local council as a dividend.

[The H man]

RE: Halton Transport

(17/06/2012 01:06)merseybus Wrote:  . 4 minibuses getting bought and 6 double deckers. And also new livery for the whole fleet.

Is there an official source for this information?