Arriva Strike

[Barney]

RE: Arriva Strike

(12/12/2017 15:31)knutstransport Wrote:  ... supermarkets employ a large number of temporary and part time workers which quite often consists of students, semi-retired workers and those who have more than one job - who are unlikely to join a union.

And that's why the comparison between Arriva (a bus company) and ASDA (a supermarket) is absurd.

[wimdebusse]

RE: Arriva Strike

(12/12/2017 10:55)Barney Wrote:  It is completely erroneous to compare bus operators with supermarkets as one provides a service whilst the other provides a product even, though they are both driven by the profit motive. In my opinion, bus drivers have a very difficult and challenging job that requires them to be in constant interaction with the public.

Have you never heard supermarket staff complaining about their working conditions and rates of pay? I do. Constantly. The reason why we never hear of supermarket workers going on strike is because, in the main, the workforce is not unionised.

As for suggesting that a myriad of bus operators would mitigate the effect of strike action can I remind all members that this was part of the rationale when buses were deregulated in 1986. In the intervening years, these new start-up bus operators have morphed into the Big Four that exist now. In essence, in many parts of the UK we now have bus provision provided by a private monopoly or, as on Merseyside, a duopoly.

The resolution is simple: pay the staff what they want.

I think you missed the point, large arias of Merseyside are the monopoly on one operator, as in Southport all the routes not operated by Arriva run along or near to the A565, which is fine for those living on or near the A565, but for everyone else it's "tuff luck" . I heard a driver asked yesterday about the strike on Wednesday and he basicly said won't know untill late on Tuesday, that's why I said Arriva and the unions have such contempt for the passengers, near as dam no notification as to whether there will be a bus service or not.

[Barney]

RE: Arriva Strike

(12/12/2017 17:06)wimdebusse Wrote:  I think you missed the point, large arias of Merseyside are the monopoly on one operator, as in Southport all the routes not operated by Arriva run along or near to the A565, which is fine for those living on or near the A565, but for everyone else it's "tuff luck" . I heard a driver asked yesterday about the strike on Wednesday and he basicly said won't know untill late on Tuesday, that's why I said Arriva and the unions have such contempt for the passengers, near as dam no notification as to whether there will be a bus service or not.

What are you objecting to? The fact that Arriva is the major operator on Merseyside, the unions have called strike action for today and then called it off as a gesture of goodwill or the fact that the strike that has already been called for Wednesday will possibly go ahead as planned?

Many drivers are of the opinion that these new derisory offers are merely a ploy to stop the planned strikes in the lead up to Christmas as this is when Arriva make substantial profits. In my opinion, it is the management who are showing contempt for the passengers.

[wimdebusse]

RE: Arriva Strike
Barney, I've expressed my opinion, you've expressed yours, let's just agree last, to disagree

[SK15 GZG (Moderator)]

RE: Arriva Strike
The deal has been accepted

[Barney]

RE: Arriva Strike

(12/12/2017 19:01)Y474 KNF Wrote:  The deal has been accepted

That is excellent news.

[RedPanda]

RE: Arriva Strike
The deal...
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/live...s-14030571
Fantastic news for everybody!

[Brickmill]

RE: Arriva Strike

(12/12/2017 17:06)wimdebusse Wrote:  I think you missed the point, large arias of Merseyside are the monopoly on one operator, as in Southport all the routes not operated by Arriva run along or near to the A565, which is fine for those living on or near the A565, but for everyone else it's "tuff luck" . I heard a driver asked yesterday about the strike on Wednesday and he basicly said won't know untill late on Tuesday, that's why I said Arriva and the unions have such contempt for the passengers, near as dam no notification as to whether there will be a bus service or not.

No need to comment on the dispute itself, now that its resolved, but Barney is right in terms of erroneous comparisons and complaints about "monopolies".
1. No bus company has a Monopoly because they are competing with all other modes of land transport.
2. Within the bus sector itself, the market has been in constant decline for many decades - the sharpest decline being 1987/8! From 346 million in 1985/6, patronage in Gtr. Manchester is expected to drop below 200 million this financial year. The market itself is shrinking in a vicious circle of service cuts, fare rises faster than competing modes, longer journey times;Media b(i)ased Social pressures, and other localised factors such as the utterly stupid change in school hours in recent decades - which based on a Granada Reports item last night is a major factor in Poverty for *Working* Parents, as well as a triple blow to the bus industry and its customers (expensive scheduling; extension of pm peak congestion and unattractive environment for law abiding adult passengers)
3. This all means that the market won't survive competition on the vast majority of routes. Further, history has told us that competition within the industry has been of lousy quality, and shown a distinct absence of innovation; no new routes, no improved service levels and only minimal fare reductions largely confined to specific sectors of society (ie. students, couples etc).

Supermarkets will always thrive as everybody has to eat and drink to survive - and indeed, it is the Retail industry that one of the bus industry's biggest enemies because it provides plentiful free parking.

[knutstransport]

RE: Arriva Strike

(12/12/2017 20:59)Brickmill Wrote:  1. No bus company has a Monopoly because they are competing with all other modes of land transport.

Even if you allow for taking very indirect routes e.g. going from Altrincham to Warrington via Manchester to avoid using Network Warrington services, I can think of plenty of places which are only served by one public transport operator.

If a public transport operator is deemed to have a monopoly they'll be forced to give up some routes e.g. Stagecoach in Preston.

[Barney]

RE: Arriva Strike

(13/12/2017 11:39)knutstransport Wrote:  Even if you allow for taking very indirect routes e.g. going from Altrincham to Warrington via Manchester to avoid using Network Warrington services, I can think of plenty of places which are only served by one public transport operator.

If a public transport operator is deemed to have a monopoly they'll be forced to give up some routes e.g. Stagecoach in Preston.

If there is only ever one bus route serving your community then, to all intents and purposes, that operator has a monopoly.