Forum | Merseyside Dennis Dart Website

Full Version: First Manchester
You're currently viewing a stripped down version of our content. View the full version with proper formatting.
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360 361 362 363 364 365 366 367 368 369 370 371 372 373 374 375 376 377 378 379 380 381 382 383 384 385 386 387 388 389 390 391 392 393 394 395 396 397 398 399 400 401 402 403 404 405 406 407 408 409 410 411 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 423 424 425 426 427 428 429 430 431 432 433 434 435 436 437 438 439 440 441 442 443 444 445 446 447 448 449 450 451 452 453 454 455 456 457 458 459 460 461 462 463 464 465 466 467 468 469 470 471 472 473 474 475 476 477 478 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 526 527 528 529 530 531 532 533 534 535 536 537 538 539 540 541 542 543 544 545 546 547 548 549 550 551 552 553 554 555 556 557 558 559 560 561 562 563 564 565 566 567 568 569 570 571 572 573 574 575 576 577 578 579 580 581 582 583 584 585 586 587 588 589 590 591 592 593 594 595 596 597 598 599 600 601 602 603 604 605 606 607 608 609 610 611 612 613 614 615 616 617 618 619 620 621 622 623 624 625 626 627 628 629 630 631 632 633 634 635 636 637 638 639 640 641 642 643 644 645 646 647 648 649 650 651 652 653 654 655 656 657 658 659 660 661 662 663 664 665 666 667 668 669 670 671 672 673 674 675 676 677 678 679 680 681 682 683 684 685 686 687 688 689 690 691 692 693 694 695 696 697 698 699 700 701 702 703 704 705 706 707 708 709 710 711 712 713 714 715 716 717 718 719 720 721 722 723 724 725 726 727 728 729 730 731
(20/02/2015 20:37)Dentonian Wrote: [ -> ]Its interesting reading this month's Buses mag, where Andrew Braddock (ex TfL) is absoultely convinced some form of Re-regulation will be implemented alongside Devolution in GM. I remain far from convinced, but it looks like Stagecoach and First believe it, and are simply throwing their dummies out of the pram, whilst illustrating exactly why essential services are not safe in private hands. At the risk of being accused of libel, I fear these fare rises are being used to cross-subsidise this increasingly damaging bus war. I assume "Quidsin" etc will still apply to the full length of the 42 when it is extended to Middleton in April....
And before anyone accuses me of having a political axe to grind, it is actually quite noticable how close to the TIF plans (remember that?) things are becoming: Improvements to bus services in south and west of the conurbation and most noticably, Middleton, alongside the earlier cuts that took place on the Hyde Road corridor.

So a huge proportion of Greater Manchester vote no and the suits say what the heck we will do it anyway. Sheer crazy.
(20/02/2015 22:11)Dentonian Wrote: [ -> ]TBF, most voted No simply because of the Congestion Charge element. It was clear from comments made at the time - fuelled by the local Motoring lobby's propoganda - that most people didn't know the first thing about how the money would have been spent, let alone the details of where bus services would be improved or otherwise.

As someone who voted NO at the time the simple reason for my vote was because information was so vague. There did seem to be little clarity on where the money would be spent and which services would be improved. It came across as another 'cash cow' way of making money.

Incidentally where does money generally go from bus lane fines? Given the amount of money Tameside council are raking in from bus lanes in Ashton I'm fairly certain that there not ploughed back into public transport.
Not sure if its out regular on lates but 36300 was out on late turn 83s last night, I saw it heading into Manchester at about 21:10 at Oldham Road/Dean Lane junction while I was on my home on 20:50 182.
35102 is spending the day on 59s, its currently on its way to Rushcroft on 10:53 service from Piccadilly
(21/02/2015 10:48)Dentonian Wrote: [ -> ]I seem to remember it was fairly clear which projects the money would be spent on, with the various phases of Metrolink, and boosting capacity on local rail as well as developing Interchange facilities between modes, such as Stockport. I think the "get out" clause for those arguing a lot of what was promised in terms of Metrolink in particular now happening anyway, was that GMPTA (as they were then) said, it would all get done, but without the C-Charge it would take a lot longer.
Details of bus services were inevitable going to be less clear, as:

a. They were not seen as relevant to the vote because they would not be paid for out of C-charge.
b. Because they ultimately remained commercial decisions, the usual 56 days notice would apply for the general public and (more relevantly) competing Operators. So final decisions would only have been made after the vote and right up to implementation.

Can't help re-Bus Lanes, but I'm sure you are right in terms of bus services at least. I can't see it benefitting other modes either, as I'm not aware of any bus lane revenue coming through TFGM/C. Maybe it goes direct to Network Rail?

The proposals were just that.... Proposals. The only dead cert was already heavily taxed motorists being charged for driving towards Manchester in the morning and vice versa in the afternoons, but as you say some of what was planned has happened anyway in regards to the Metrolink. Debatable whether that's been a success or a white elephant.

I've always avoided the bus lanes arguments in the past but my comment refered to a story regarding Tameside council handing out hundreds of bus lane fines to motorists who inadvertently used bus lanes on Oldham road in Ashton (see the link to First and the 409 Smile), on Christmas Day, Boxing Day and New Year's Day when buses arnt even running. I found it quite ironical given the ongoing cuts to subsidised bus services.

Anyway bringing things back into topic it seems First are already receiving a backlash from passengers if comments on Twitter are anything to go by.
(20/02/2015 20:37)Dentonian Wrote: [ -> ]Its interesting reading this month's Buses mag, where Andrew Braddock (ex TfL) is absoultely convinced some form of Re-regulation will be implemented alongside Devolution in GM. I remain far from convinced, but it looks like Stagecoach and First believe it, and are simply throwing their dummies out of the pram, whilst illustrating exactly why essential services are not safe in private hands. At the risk of being accused of libel, I fear these fare rises are being used to cross-subsidise this increasingly damaging bus war. I assume "Quidsin" etc will still apply to the full length of [undefined=undefined]the 42 when it is extended to Middleton in April....[/undefined]
And before anyone accuses me of having a political axe to grind, it is actually quite noticable how close to the TIF plans (remember that?) things are becoming: Improvements to bus services in south and west of the conurbation and most noticably, Middleton, alongside the earlier cuts that took place on the Hyde Road corridor.

This is news to me. This East Didsbury - Middleton route is just the sort of link I thought Stagecoach would want to introduce having garages in south Manchester and Middleton.
That'll explain the Route and Timetable change on VOSA this week. Question would be which route would it take to/from Middleton.

PC0003680/882 - FIRST MANCHESTER LTD T/A FIRST, WALLSHAW STREET, OLDHAM, OL1 3TR
Variation Accepted: Operating between MANCHESTER PICCADILLY and EAST DIDSBURY given service number 42 effective from 12-Apr-2015. To amend Route and Timetable.

There are a few Route and Timetable changes on VOSA this week for First services in April: 17/17A/18, 64, 88/89, 95, 98, 180/184/X80, 408, 454/457, 510.

Should imagine some details will come out soon, as there is a TfGM bus committee meeting scheduled for early March.
They have no sympathy with me, and I imagine the public will be outraged by the price increases. With inflation at record lows and energy prices plummeting what excuse will they have? 'Competitive pressures' I am guessing, in other words a bus war.

Will the 42 be extended from NMGH to Middleton? Or will the 42 that terminates at Piccadilly be extended?
I would laugh if Stagecoach held their current prices or slightly reduced them to show up First, it would go down well with passengers
At what frequency will the 42 be at to Middleton may I ask?
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360 361 362 363 364 365 366 367 368 369 370 371 372 373 374 375 376 377 378 379 380 381 382 383 384 385 386 387 388 389 390 391 392 393 394 395 396 397 398 399 400 401 402 403 404 405 406 407 408 409 410 411 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 423 424 425 426 427 428 429 430 431 432 433 434 435 436 437 438 439 440 441 442 443 444 445 446 447 448 449 450 451 452 453 454 455 456 457 458 459 460 461 462 463 464 465 466 467 468 469 470 471 472 473 474 475 476 477 478 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 526 527 528 529 530 531 532 533 534 535 536 537 538 539 540 541 542 543 544 545 546 547 548 549 550 551 552 553 554 555 556 557 558 559 560 561 562 563 564 565 566 567 568 569 570 571 572 573 574 575 576 577 578 579 580 581 582 583 584 585 586 587 588 589 590 591 592 593 594 595 596 597 598 599 600 601 602 603 604 605 606 607 608 609 610 611 612 613 614 615 616 617 618 619 620 621 622 623 624 625 626 627 628 629 630 631 632 633 634 635 636 637 638 639 640 641 642 643 644 645 646 647 648 649 650 651 652 653 654 655 656 657 658 659 660 661 662 663 664 665 666 667 668 669 670 671 672 673 674 675 676 677 678 679 680 681 682 683 684 685 686 687 688 689 690 691 692 693 694 695 696 697 698 699 700 701 702 703 704 705 706 707 708 709 710 711 712 713 714 715 716 717 718 719 720 721 722 723 724 725 726 727 728 729 730 731
Reference URL's