[Archive] Northern (Arriva Rail North)

[Gordon V]

RE: Northern (Arriva Rail North)

(17/11/2016 21:17)Dentonian Wrote:  What happens to pax who needed to get off at these intermediate Stations (St Helens in this case)? Also, do such contingency plans apply to all Lines, and is it enacted en route, such that waiting passengers only find out having stood for over 15 minutes on the platform, that the train will not be stopping - and as such, alternatives (ie. catching a bus instead) would no longer be viable? Just curious as on Tuesday my train to work was showing on Time at the scheduled departure time, but 15 late, just a minute later. Consequently, I dashed out for a bus instead, but had I decided to brave it for the train (on the basis I should not have been in time for the bus I did catch), would I have actually ended up (about) 40 minutes late for work, because the train bypassed my Station and I would have had to leg it back to a bus stop, in time to miss another bus.

In the case of this service originally mentioned,1200 Lime St-Wigan the service sets off from Lime St with all passengers for intermediate stations such as St Helens already detrained so the original poster who saw passengers on board these would be passengers who boarded at Lime St who were travelling to Wigan only,passengers detrained at Lime St and passengers at stations between Edge Hill and Bryn inclusive would have to get the next available service,1232 Lime St-Wigan.Occasionally the plan is enacted en route if the traincrew for such a service can be contacted en route for instance yesterday there was a problem with an ATW service at Newton LW which only occurred after the 1002 Manchester Victoria-Lime St left Manchester Victoria,this train (and others) were caught up in the subsequent disruption so this train ran none stop Earlestown-Lime St to lessen the delay but obviously when the train originally left Manchester Vic it departed with the intention of calling all stations to Lime St.As regards the latter part of what you say had you of risked waiting for the train that was late you may well not of been in luck had stops been taken out of the train and it went zooming past you.You would then have to weigh up what is quicker,next train after this or next bus.As for whether the contingency plan exists for all lines,certainly local to Merseyside,yes,Merseyrail do similar to Northern and knock stops out on late trains

[childwallblues]

RE: Northern (Arriva Rail North)
Thank you Gordon for your explanation re the situation.

[Gordon V]

RE: Northern (Arriva Rail North)

(18/11/2016 07:14)childwallblues Wrote:  Thank you Gordon for your explanation re the situation.

You're welcome

[wirralbus]

RE: Northern (Arriva Rail North)

(17/11/2016 21:30)Gordon V Wrote:  In the case of this service originally mentioned,1200 Lime St-Wigan the service sets off from Lime St with all passengers for intermediate stations such as St Helens already detrained so the original poster who saw passengers on board these would be passengers who boarded at Lime St who were travelling to Wigan only,passengers detrained at Lime St and passengers at stations between Edge Hill and Bryn inclusive would have to get the next available service,1232 Lime St-Wigan.Occasionally the plan is enacted en route if the traincrew for such a service can be contacted en route for instance yesterday there was a problem with an ATW service at Newton LW which only occurred after the 1002 Manchester Victoria-Lime St left Manchester Victoria,this train (and others) were caught up in the subsequent disruption so this train ran none stop Earlestown-Lime St to lessen the delay but obviously when the train originally left Manchester Vic it departed with the intention of calling all stations to Lime St.As regards the latter part of what you say had you of risked waiting for the train that was late you may well not of been in luck had stops been taken out of the train and it went zooming past you.You would then have to weigh up what is quicker,next train after this or next bus.As for whether the contingency plan exists for all lines,certainly local to Merseyside,yes,Merseyrail do similar to Northern and knock stops out on late trains

The bigger difference with Merseyrail is this is only one part of service recovery , with merseyrail they use it in different options particular for Chester services.

It seems that Northern Rail do seem to use the most severest form of limited stop which is Liverpool - Wigan limited stop , if a service is due to pass say St Helens Central at the time booked , but still runs non stop , the service will reach Springs Branch early and just be held till booked time , due to the possibility of arriving early at terminating station , early running is as bad as late running.

[Gordon V]

RE: Northern (Arriva Rail North)

(19/11/2016 06:22)wirralbus Wrote:  The bigger difference with Merseyrail is this is only one part of service recovery , with merseyrail they use it in different options particular for Chester services.

It seems that Northern Rail do seem to use the most severest form of limited stop which is Liverpool - Wigan limited stop , if a service is due to pass say St Helens Central at the time booked , but still runs non stop , the service will reach Springs Branch early and just be held till booked time , due to the possibility of arriving early at terminating station , early running is as bad as late running.

Sometimes Liverpool-Wigan services go none stop to Huyton or none stop to St Helens Central so none stop to Wigan is the worst case scenario but there are a couple of things to remember,Northern services travel a greater distance to Merseyrail and Merseyrail is a self contained network,Northern services have to contend with other TOCs for space track access wise,if a Northern service that is late runs booked stops it risks delaying another TOC

[childwallblues]

RE: Northern (Arriva Rail North)

(19/11/2016 06:22)wirralbus Wrote:  The bigger difference with Merseyrail is this is only one part of service recovery , with merseyrail they use it in different options particular for Chester services.

It seems that Northern Rail do seem to use the most severest form of limited stop which is Liverpool - Wigan limited stop , if a service is due to pass say St Helens Central at the time booked , but still runs non stop , the service will reach Springs Branch early and just be held till booked time , due to the possibility of arriving early at terminating station , early running is as bad as late running.

I can assure you that the trains are not held at Springs Branch if the line is not blocked. Arrival at WGN 3-4 minutes early is quite normal.

[St Helens Rider]

RE: Northern (Arriva Rail North)
The service does have recovery time built in. Bryn - Wigan is timetabled at 11 minutes when it can be done far quicker than this.

[N271CKB]

RE: Northern (Arriva Rail North)
Signalling problems near Lime Street causing lots of delays and cancellations this morning

[Gordon V]

RE: Northern (Arriva Rail North)

(24/11/2016 11:11)N271CKB Wrote:  Signalling problems at Lime Street causing lots of delays and cancellations this morning

Should be back to normal approx 1230

[boby32]

RE: Northern (Arriva Rail North)
This is the live signal at Lime Street.

http://www.charlwoodhouse.co.uk/rail/livesig/3