Warrington's Own Buses

[Jack]

RE: WBT Network Warrington
To be fair I think this whole GHA thing is being over analysed, it's likely just to be the 16 to give the bus something to do rather than laying over in the interchange between 45s. If another service is registered then maybe things will be different but for now I doubt NW or even Fairbrothers need to be worried.

[Mayneway]

RE: WBT Network Warrington

(26/03/2015 16:31)jcksmnr Wrote:  To be fair I think this whole GHA thing is being over analysed, it's likely just to be the 16 to give the bus something to do rather than laying over in the interchange between 45s. If another service is registered then maybe things will be different but for now I doubt NW or even Fairbrothers need to be worried.

All good and well but if GHA spot a decent enough market and demand is high enough then they may quickly make inroads into Warrington.
GHA might run round empty or they may be overwhelmed by demand and as a business may consider expansion onto other Warrington services, having said that, IF Fairbrothers claims that the council has thwarted their attempts to expand then GHA may find it as difficult.

[Website Admin (Administrator)]

RE: WBT Network Warrington
I have removed some posts here that contributed nothing to the thread. Any further posts that are deemed off topic or appear to be attacking other members will be deleted without warning.

[stankevitch]

RE: WBT Network Warrington
RSTurbo50,

As a fellow Warrington resident I see you are somewhat biased towards WBT. £5.50 is very steep for a day rover, when you can consider the distance travelled vs the price paid, even forgetting weekly and monthy tickets, I offer the following example:

Knutsford Rd/Wash Ln to Warrington Town Centre:

£2.20 single on WBT
£1.80 return on Fairbrothers.

So thats £4.40 compared to £1.80, thats more than a saving of a quid, and think of someone who takes that journey 3-4 times a week, but isnt guarenteed to Need to use the bus 5 out of 7 days. That works out at quite a saving over time.

And on the topic of WBT rises, has anyone taken into account the over-the-top fare rises, even adding up for the fuel price increase, Oil plummeted recently with at the pump garage prices dropping as much as 20p a litre, that must have a knock-on effect in the industry for a smaller operator like WBT who AFAIK doesnt hedge their fuel prices.

You also say about maintained vehicles and such, yes Fairbrothers Trident fleet isnt the newest, but remember that WBTs deckers are also the same ex-London ones, some even being near the same batch, so you have a moot point there. Plus they are also painted and clean, the insides arnt the likes of leather seating but then neither is WBT, and basic prices mean no frills al a Ryanair and Travelodge. You dont pay £40 for a hotel room and expect a mint on your pillow and the turn down team do you?

And as someone who used to IIRC drive for Fairbrothers, since jumping ship you seem to have made aa complete 180-degree swing on your opinion, not that im knocking it, there is just a bigger picture to look at.


And one more point, Fairbrothers mainly does the 1C, 16X and 21X, along with a few school and can still buy many 2nd hand deckers and suit them up nice, what did WBT last buy with all their increased fares? I certainly havnt seen anything different from them apart from route cuts...

[GHA Coaches]

RE: WBT Network Warrington

(26/03/2015 09:37)RSTurbo50 Wrote:  If I was a passenger I'd rather pay a bit more using Network Warrington with more modern and well maintained vehicles then saving no more than a pound and use an older, less maintained vehicle with drivers that aren't as monitored quite the same as Network Warringtons drivers.

I think you will find that with the ongoing installation of Greenroad and a new hands free communication system GHA drivers will be as well monitored as NW drivers, and with regards to maintenance do you have any specific examples of vehicles being less maintained than another operator?

[motormayhem1]

RE: WBT Network Warrington
To be fair warrington transport dont need to buy anymore new veichles just yet as there fleet is still more modern than most , as look at arriva , first etc still running around with buses older than warringtons and agree that fairbrothers are really like a no frills you get what you pay for and so long as it gets you to where you want to go safely and on time then thats all you need.

[RSTurbo50]

RE: WBT Network Warrington
I'm still a big fan of Fairbrothers and would never criticise the company for what they are trying to achieve. I guess some people will always have something against Network Warrington and this constant talk of high prices is getting to be a constant bore.

If Arriva or Stagecoach were to get in you can wave goodbye to services such as the 4A, 31, 16A, 23A, 29's, etc and you probably wouldn't have various circulars such as the 11,12 (A), 14,15, 20,21, they would probably just run one of these.

As for our Volvo deckers they are much more expensive to buy than the equivalent Dennis Trident/ DAF Deckers.

Network Warrington also has garage staff, office staff as well as drivers to pay whereas Fairbrothers have 6 drivers and 2 engineers and that's it so they can operate at a cheaper price as their overheads are a lot smaller...

[mtl97]

RE: WBT Network Warrington
if gha can make it pay then they will expand into warrington with more routes, stagecoach started a route in ellesmere port against gha & it was stagecoach who ended up cancelled their route first even though stagecoach had cheaper fares, im surprised how big gha have got in recent years in Cheshire & I can only see them expanding further

[126th street]

RE: WBT Network Warrington

(27/03/2015 01:03)stankevitch Wrote:  Knutsford Rd/Wash Ln to Warrington Town Centre:

£2.20 single on WBT
£1.80 return on Fairbrothers.

So thats £4.40 compared to £1.80, thats more than a saving of a quid, and think of someone who takes that journey 3-4 times a week, but isnt guarenteed to Need to use the bus 5 out of 7 days. That works out at quite a saving over time.

And on the topic of WBT rises, has anyone taken into account the over-the-top fare rises, even adding up for the fuel price increase, Oil plummeted recently with at the pump garage prices dropping as much as 20p a litre, that must have a knock-on effect in the industry for a smaller operator like WBT who AFAIK doesnt hedge their fuel prices.

Fares will be higher on WBT for some obvious reasons, not least that the cost of its operation will be substantially higher than bargain basement outfits such as Fairbrothers. WBT's drivers' union is exceptionally strong and some of the terms and conditions they operate under will naturally inflate how much it costs to run its buses.

However, charging £1.80 as a return fare is simply not economically viable in the long term unless you are running around with full buses all day. Stagecoach's fares are acknowledged to be on the low side, but how far can you get for £1.80 with Stagecoach? Not far, and for good reason. Buses are expensive to buy, they are expensive to maintain, they are expensive to run at 6-7mpg (at best) for a Trident, they are expensive to maintain and drivers do not work for nothing.

Plenty of operators have come in and attempted to make a long-term business out of charging rock bottom fares. Few, if any, realise that ambition.

As for the pump price of diesel, an operator of WBT's size is about as likely to be paying pump price as it is to start a service between Warrington and the moon. Even if it's not hedging, it will be paying the bulk Platt's price or thereabouts.

[RSTurbo50]

RE: WBT Network Warrington
^^^^

At last a man that makes sense. Couldn't have put it better myself.