Arriva North West - Runcorn Depot

[Raawwwrrr!]

RE: Arriva North West - Runcorn Depot

(30/12/2020 12:35)Liamkennedy2231 Wrote:  Does anyone happen to have any update on the X1 please? On BusTimes the notes just say “Cancellation of Service”. Looking like it may become a tendered service?

More likely to be outright cancelled altogether

[PAUL2511]

RE: Arriva North West - Runcorn Depot

(30/12/2020 13:12)Raawwwrrr! Wrote:  More likely to be outright cancelled altogether

If you have a look on MP Travel think there's something on there about the X1

[Liamkennedy2231]

RE: Arriva North West - Runcorn Depot

(30/12/2020 13:12)Raawwwrrr! Wrote:  More likely to be outright cancelled altogether

There was a massive uproar from Runcorn residents when they planned to withdraw it last time.

I'm assuming this is why it's being kept under wraps thus far

[Liamkennedy2231]

RE: Arriva North West - Runcorn Depot

(30/12/2020 17:54)PAUL2511 Wrote:  If you have a look on MP Travel think there's something on there about the X1

Yeah I think that's to do with the vintage running day, as it is looking likely it may not run now due to Tier 3 restrictions taking affect on the Liverpool City Region. Seems like they're saying they'd rather put normal service buses on as dupes so they are able to meet capacity demands. Thanks for that though.

It does look like the service is coming to a quiet conclusion unfortunately

[T42 PVM (Moderator)]

RE: Arriva North West - Runcorn Depot

(30/12/2020 20:02)Liamkennedy2231 Wrote:  There was a massive uproar from Runcorn residents when they planned to withdraw it last time.

I'm assuming this is why it's being kept under wraps thus far

I made a Blog Post the last time i got a few thousand views and like 100 Comments, The local Residents where not happy one bit.

[Liamkennedy2231]

RE: Arriva North West - Runcorn Depot

(30/12/2020 20:46)T42 PVM Wrote:  I made a Blog Post the last time i got a few thousand views and like 100 Comments, The local Residents where not happy one bit.

I did notice that! Comment section was an absolute rage fest, compared to other posts which had a few comments here and there.

I remember a local MP (Weaver Vale I think it was) saying he had regular talks with Arriva, saying it wasn't right that a route could only run if it is a profitable operation

[Barney]

RE: Arriva North West - Runcorn Depot

(30/12/2020 21:43)Liamkennedy2231 Wrote:  I remember a local MP (Weaver Vale I think it was) saying he had regular talks with Arriva, saying it wasn't right that a route could only run if it is a profitable operation

Obviously, the MP for Weaver Vale (Lab) was unaware that the 1985 Transport Act said exactly that though I do wonder how much tax-payers money has been diverted to privatised bus companies this year through emergency grants? Apparently, the rail operators are receiving £1 million PER HOUR!

[Raawwwrrr!]

RE: Arriva North West - Runcorn Depot
The issue with the X1 is that it’s no longer profitable in each direction. Passengers travel to Liverpool in the morning and to Runcorn in the evening, very few make the trip in the opposite direction or during day, and quite simply it’s not cheap to run a limited stop service.

You could probably do what other operators do like Go North West and run the occasional X1 in each direction during peak hours (such as their x39) but the issue then becomes what does that bus do during the day? Does it just sit in the depot? Does it come off the 79c or 82a for example?

[iMarkeh]

RE: Arriva North West - Runcorn Depot

(31/12/2020 02:56)Raawwwrrr! Wrote:  The issue with the X1 is that it’s no longer profitable in each direction. Passengers travel to Liverpool in the morning and to Runcorn in the evening, very few make the trip in the opposite direction or during day, and quite simply it’s not cheap to run a limited stop service.

You could probably do what other operators do like Go North West and run the occasional X1 in each direction during peak hours (such as their x39) but the issue then becomes what does that bus do during the day? Does it just sit in the depot? Does it come off the 79c or 82a for example?

I think on top of that, you have this issue which Trimax200 pointed out

(24/12/2020 17:23)trixmax2000 Wrote:  I would say around 75% of passengers using this service have either Arriva Weekly & Day tickets and feed into the X1 from other Arriva services

From what I have seen and experienced with Arriva, they do not tend to use day and weekly ticket revenue to share out among routes which accept these passes. They seem to judge the viability of each trip depending on how much money was taken on that trip (IE a bus could be full but if it's all weekly pass users, in their eyes, it's not viable since no actual cash was taken). If, as Trimax says, 75% of passengers are using Arriva tickets bought on other services, that will be why Arriva claim it isn't viable even though a number of trips are very busy.
I think a further point is that the service has been plagued by the Arriva 'Death by 100 cuts' which has been a huge deterrent to passengers.

[Gillmoss 0324]

RE: Arriva North West - Runcorn Depot

(31/12/2020 02:56)Raawwwrrr! Wrote:  The issue with the X1 is that it’s no longer profitable in each direction. Passengers travel to Liverpool in the morning and to Runcorn in the evening, very few make the trip in the opposite direction or during day, and quite simply it’s not cheap to run a limited stop service.

You could probably do what other operators do like Go North West and run the occasional X1 in each direction during peak hours (such as their x39) but the issue then becomes what does that bus do during the day? Does it just sit in the depot? Does it come off the 79c or 82a for example?

I thought the same about the X1. The only thing that might save it is if it became a M-F peak service, the thing with that is it's got to be 100% reliable if not you'll kill any passenger loyalty for the route. That won't be easy when it's coming in/out of gridlock especially at those peak times as/when we get over this Covid problem.

Making it peak only will also put costs on an operator like Arriva/MP Travel or anyone else looking to take that on as it will need a fair bit of resources to ensure it remains reliable, I think some of Arriva's Liverpool services have had to have things like extra recovery time and changeover vehicles on standby to ensure the routes keep to time as let's say over the last 15-20 or so years the city has become very gridlocked whether or not the initiatives during these years have tried to have the best intentions not to lead to this.

Could another solution be introducing a 82X which runs like the X1 (Limited Stop) from Runcorn to Speke Boulevard then becomes a stopping service from there to the city.

Just out of interest do many passengers use the 79C/82A's from Runcorn to Liverpool? I can see them being used to Widnes but beyond to Runcorn wouldn't it be quicker to bus it to Runcorn station and use the train from Lime Street. Also has the train had a impact on how successful a express like the X1 can be?

Again as things stand bus operation is all on profit and demand and if these are low or impacted by things like Covid services will be cut/withdrawn. Sadly I think it's all over for the X1 even the X30's can't be that safe either?