Stagecoach Manchester and Wigan

[Brickmill]

RE: Stagecoach Manchester and Wigan

(26/10/2018 18:43)Mrboo Wrote:  I think your better to lose XXX numbers and replace with X or a letter or XX as it more easy to remember and gives more room for bigger bus destination info. yes if your service goes to other town you should use xxx and bring back X limited stop and x for part route

And you know better than the people who have been using buses in and around Wigan for the last 40 years do you?

GM has had a comprehensive numbering system to avoid confusion and duplication for more than a generation, albeit there are some unneccessary examples dotted around the county - such as First's 19. This is just a cynical ploy by Stagecoach to divide and rule as they try to generate as much uncertainty as possible leading up to any public consultation on Franchising.
It would be interesting to see what happens if TFGM refuse to renumber SUBSIDISED service 601 to 10A. Of course, in reality they won't.
Still, on the plus side, the service to Bolton is numbered 7, not 8 (lol)

[Mrboo]

RE: Stagecoach Manchester and Wigan

(26/10/2018 21:21)Brickmill Wrote:  And you know better than the people who have been using buses in and around Wigan for the last 40 years do you?

GM has had a comprehensive numbering system to avoid confusion and duplication for more than a generation, albeit there are some unneccessary examples dotted around the county - such as First's 19. This is just a cynical ploy by Stagecoach to divide and rule as they try to generate as much uncertainty as possible leading up to any public consultation on Franchising.
It would be interesting to see what happens if TFGM refuse to renumber SUBSIDISED service 601 to 10A. Of course, in reality they won't.
Still, on the plus side, the service to Bolton is numbered 7, not 8 (lol)

Trends change head over to Trent Barton they have 1 route with a number. Branding is a tool that can get people to change to buses. wth the new network with new numbers it comes across as a Great new bus network for Wigan we know it just as it was but for car users they dont know this and it Great having buses with numbers on the side but as I know when your a bus short you endup with a branded bus off route and people don't put there hand out. Everyone here is a bus user But there a world out there that people never used a bus or not since they was a child. it does make sense to number as simple as you can. can anyone here think telling a new user to get the 1 or 2 is as simple as you can get. when it was the old days there would of been more mix up with having a 1 and 2 at every depot in the group of depots we are now in a world that 7 in Stockport/Ashton is not going to get mix up with a 7 in Wigan or 7 in Rochdale but when it eas GMPTE or before there would of been paperwork at same office for routes in all areas. So there was a system made to help them.

[EDB325]

RE: Stagecoach Manchester and Wigan
For me, route branding only really works when different liveries are used for each route, as in Nottingham (both major operators), Transdev, or with Go Ahead in the North East.

Stagecoach don't often do that, but I'd love it if they introduced it in Wigan !

[Brickmill]

RE: Stagecoach Manchester and Wigan

(27/10/2018 23:49)Mrboo Wrote:  Trends change head over to Trent Barton they have 1 route with a number. Branding is a tool that can get people to change to buses. wth the new network with new numbers it comes across as a Great new bus network for Wigan we know it just as it was but for car users they dont know this and it Great having buses with numbers on the side but as I know when your a bus short you endup with a branded bus off route and people don't put there hand out. Everyone here is a bus user But there a world out there that people never used a bus or not since they was a child. it does make sense to number as simple as you can. can anyone here think telling a new user to get the 1 or 2 is as simple as you can get. when it was the old days there would of been more mix up with having a 1 and 2 at every depot in the group of depots we are now in a world that 7 in Stockport/Ashton is not going to get mix up with a 7 in Wigan or 7 in Rochdale but when it eas GMPTE or before there would of been paperwork at same office for routes in all areas. So there was a system made to help them.

This is an indication of just how obsessed with image rather than reality we have become. Do you honestly think existing motorists are going to switch to buses in this day and age? If I had spent a fortune on acquiring and insuring a car, I wouldn't touch public transport with a barge pole; Buses are FAR too expensive (10 times the cost of diesel for round trips to the Supermarket/town centre) and FAR too slow (average 7 mph in the peak, barely 10 mph off-peak). It is also pot luck as to whether you get a comfortable bus that is supposed to be allocated to your route or a bus that hasn't been re-furbished since it was delivered a decade ago. Oh! and if your bus is a MagicBus, you should be charged MagicBus fares.

The main reason that the patronage decline is accelerating in GM especially, is that the Operators are "betraying" their loyal, car-less customer base, by slashing services and hiking fares 2.8 times inflation every year.

[B10B6514]

RE: Stagecoach Manchester and Wigan
Wigan garage have added useful info for passengers on their renumbered routes- saw a 6 which bore the legend "Previously the 626" underneath "Beech Hill " destination. Cracking use of Hannover blinds.

[RedPanda]

RE: Stagecoach Manchester and Wigan

(28/10/2018 23:55)B10B6514 Wrote:  Wigan garage have added useful info for passengers on their renumbered routes- saw a 6 which bore the legend "Previously the 626" underneath "Beech Hill " destination. Cracking use of Hannover blinds.

But the negative probably will be routes via x, switching to previously route y every ten seconds or so. For people with good eyesight that’s fine, but anybody with bad eyesight that’s a problem. Either that or the board has condensation.

[rod_259]

RE: Stagecoach Manchester and Wigan
I agree with your comments wholeheartedly and still don’t understand why there are so few cross city services compared with them being the norm in the ‘old days’ when I was a lad! Both First and Stagecoach could provide cross city services but the Local Authorities haven’t helped by virtually closing down streets through the city centre and First have pulled the 42. Even with an Oyster type card you still have to trail from one side of Piccadilly to the other. Also if you work in the Deansgate area there are hardly any decent bus connections apart from limited ones up King Street. There used to be services to Altrichman, Chorlton and South M@nchester despite all the shops, offices and leisure services which h@v3 grown up over the years.

[dca529x]

RE: Stagecoach Manchester and Wigan

(28/10/2018 23:55)B10B6514 Wrote:  Wigan garage have added useful info for passengers on their renumbered routes- saw a 6 which bore the legend "Previously the 626" underneath "Beech Hill " destination. Cracking use of Hannover blinds.

If they have to resort to doing that, then that just demonstrates an admission to it being a familiar number. so, if it's an familiar number, why change it ?. Dumbing down, nothing more.

[djb]

RE: Stagecoach Manchester and Wigan

(29/10/2018 10:36)rod_259 Wrote:  I agree with your comments wholeheartedly and still don’t understand why there are so few cross city services compared with them being the norm in the ‘old days’ when I was a lad! Both First and Stagecoach could provide cross city services but the Local Authorities haven’t helped by virtually closing down streets through the city centre and First have pulled the 42. Even with an Oyster type card you still have to trail from one side of Piccadilly to the other. Also if you work in the Deansgate area there are hardly any decent bus connections apart from limited ones up King Street. There used to be services to Altrichman, Chorlton and South M@nchester despite all the shops, offices and leisure services which h@v3 grown up over the years.

Apologies if the above post seems rather out of place. I posted a long reply to brickmills post, then accidentally deleted it on edit (around the time the reply was posted).

Probably too long to re-type, and to be honest digressing too far from stagecoach.

The general gist was that there is one thing that can Persuade lost or new fare paying bus users to return, and it’s not new buses, high frequency services, or route numbers that stay the same since the invention of the motorbus / don’t conflict with one somewhere else in the borough. These are the passengers that can stabilise the industry, not loyalty to car-less passengers (which would be maintained in a stable system anyway)

It’s a decent, dynamic, flexible multimodal ticketing system (like oyster), combined with reliable use of technology for real-time.

[Brickmill]

RE: Stagecoach Manchester and Wigan

(29/10/2018 17:09)djb Wrote:  Apologies if the above post seems rather out of place. I posted a long reply to brickmills post, then accidentally deleted it on edit (around the time the reply was posted).

Probably too long to re-type, and to be honest digressing too far from stagecoach.

The general gist was that there is one thing that can Persuade lost or new fare paying bus users to return, and it’s not new buses, high frequency services, or route numbers that stay the same since the invention of the motorbus / don’t conflict with one somewhere else in the borough. These are the passengers that can stabilise the industry, not loyalty to car-less passengers (which would be maintained in a stable system anyway)

Congratulations, you have just been promoted to Stagecoach CEO! Why would car-less passengers be maintained in a "stable" system - whatever that means?

Clearly, we have fundamentally opposing ideas both politically and ethically, so there is no point in me even trying to argue the point.