Services which don't exist but there could be demand for

[joe_alker]

RE: Services which don't exist but there could be demand for
The one that always got me was when Mayne were took over by Stagecoach, we (Droylsden) lost quite a lot of services to outlying areas past Ashton.

I believe at various points we have had links to Oldham, Mossley, Stalybridge, Brookbottom and Carrbrook.

Now we have a every 15-minute service 231 (with every other bus going to Ashton) with no Stagecoach link to any of those areas apart from the 236/7 to Stalybridge from Ashton. Mossley does have the train station so it retains a link to Manchester, but areas such as Brookbottom, Carrbrook and Dukinfield have no direct link to Manchester. Dukinfield has the 221 which runs once in a blue moon (or 1 journey at peak times) and for the 236/7, I think it wasn't the greatest idea curtailing them at Ashton, as having a limited stop service between Ashton and Manchester is quite a good idea.

[Mayneway]

RE: Services which don't exist but there could be demand for

(16/09/2015 19:18)joe_alker Wrote:  The one that always got me was when Mayne were took over by Stagecoach, we (Droylsden) lost quite a lot of services to outlying areas past Ashton.

I believe at various points we have had links to Oldham, Mossley, Stalybridge, Brookbottom and Carrbrook.

Now we have a every 15-minute service 231 (with every other bus going to Ashton) with no Stagecoach link to any of those areas apart from the 236/7 to Stalybridge from Ashton. Mossley does have the train station so it retains a link to Manchester, but areas such as Brookbottom, Carrbrook and Dukinfield have no direct link to Manchester. Dukinfield has the 221 which runs once in a blue moon (or 1 journey at peak times) and for the 236/7, I think it wasn't the greatest idea curtailing them at Ashton, as having a limited stop service between Ashton and Manchester is quite a good idea.

It's interesting that you mention Maynes as I was thinking about them today while reading this very thread.
The sale of Maynes and the changes Stagecoach made soon after prove how different operators see areas as viable or not. I'm up the road from you Joe in Ashton. Now at one one stage I'm
Sure there was a Maynes bus running through towards Manchester past daisy nook every 12 mins (including 230 and of course 231 from Littlemoss). Compare it to now and the link although still there is poor with one bus every half an hour from Ashton.
Mossley was also left high and dry by Stagecoach, dispite the good loads Maynes carried up there at peak. What's interesting about Mossley was that several years later there was still quite a lot of demand for a direct Mossley-Manchester link hence Speedwell launching the S50 - a service that should have taken off but sadly failed!
Question is after all these years would direct links between Mossley/Carrbrook and Manchrster still work.

I used to use the 236 from Piccadilly to Glossop some afternoons just as the Enviro200's started to arrive. It was surprising how many people travelled on past Ashton to Stalybridge,Mottram and Glossop (despite the train being a lot quicker), it always surprised me when they curtailed it but wasn't surprised given the chaos heading into Droylsden in the name of progress, but given that the progress has now been achieved (apparently) would extending some 236/237's to Piccadilly again really work?

Working in glossop it's surprising, espically more recently with the loss of the current rolling train stock to the midlands how many people up there talk about having a direct bus service from Glossop to Manchester. One possibly maybe to extend certain 201s into Glossop.

A realistic idea maybe to sligtly alter the 168/169 route to follow the former diversion over Crowhill (while Oldham road was closed last year!). It was surprising how many people it picked up on Crowhill, although a lot seemed to be OAP's, but would mean the subsidised 339 service could go!

[St Helens Rider]

RE: Services which don't exist but there could be demand for
What Greater Manchester is missing generally is the big Express network they used to have - from Manchester City Centre, there was fast buses to Liverpool, Rawtenstall (at one stage extended to Accrington briefly), Glossop and Blackrod (I think there were others but can't remember all of them) as well as fast circular services around surrounding towns as per 400/1 (Wigan/Bolton - Bury - Rochdale - Ashton - Stockport), 402 (Bolton - Leigh - Warrington) and 500 (Bolton - Eccles - Altrincham - Airport).

[Mayneway]

RE: Services which don't exist but there could be demand for

(16/09/2015 20:00)St Helens Rider Wrote:  What Greater Manchester is missing generally is the big Express network they used to have - from Manchester City Centre, there was fast buses to Liverpool, Rawtenstall (at one stage extended to Accrington briefly), Glossop and Blackrod (I think there were others but can't remember all of them) as well as fast circular services around surrounding towns as per 400/1 (Wigan/Bolton - Bury - Rochdale - Ashton - Stockport), 402 (Bolton - Leigh - Warrington) and 500 (Bolton - Eccles - Altrincham - Airport).

Express services are a good idea but they can be troublesome. I can remember most times I travelled on Stagecoach's X36/37 to Glossop arguments broke out between the Driver and passengers who wanted to get off at stops in Ancoats or clayton, not realising it was limited stop.

The 400/401 always looks like a good route on paper but I can remember in it's latter days when run by Bluebus/First it often only carried a handfull of OAP's.

I suppose stagecoach and first would argue that these kinds of cross city services arnt needed with though tickets more readily available and better connections between most frequent services.

[MPTE1955]

RE: Services which don't exist but there could be demand for
That can be easily rectified these days by having next stop announcements on buses that operate the express service that way people know where they are. Much like Arriva's sapphire services for example.

[Wright Eclipse]

RE: Services which don't exist but there could be demand for
How About A Service Connecting some of the more outer parts of Bolton District with Manchester,Something like From Horwich,Via Markland Hill,Ladybridge,Daubhill,Farnworth Then Limited Stop Via Walkden,Swinton & Salford Into Manchester.Hourly Frequency Giving New Links From Horwich & Ladybridge Areas Direct Into Manchester,as well as offering Faster Journeys along A6 (Another way to hit back at Stagecoach as well)

[Mayneway]

RE: Services which don't exist but there could be demand for

(16/09/2015 20:43)Dentonian Wrote:  I've already mentioned 400/1, which was ruined by the M60, which not only made car journeys much faster on paper, but produced congestion around junctions and when the slightest bump occured on the Motorway. Heap Bridge and the whole of Denton being the most regular problems.

Expresses were withdrawn because congestion made them totally pointless. Buses would crawl past passengers waiting at stops that they weren't registered to stop at.

Cross city services are a different matter altogether. Manchester City Council banned them in 1995, exploiting a tragic accident as their excuse. The facility has recently been partly restored, but the beneficiaries are completely different as a photo in October's Buses mag illustrates

Can you go into any more detail regarding the 1995 accident. I know you've mentioned it once already (possibly on another site). I started following the bus scene in Manchester from the mid 90's while at school but for the life of me cannot think of it (probably me getting older)

Incidentally was the 400/1 commercial till it's demise or was it ever subsidised?

[Jack]

RE: Services which don't exist but there could be demand for

(16/09/2015 06:17)M60lad Wrote:  Another service that could work and I'd love to see brought back is 339 Warrington-St Helens via Burtonwood, St Helens Central and St Helens Hospital that Fairway Travel operated, I used to use this service a lot and quite a number of the journies left Warrington with good loads with some people using the service between Warrington and Burtonwood (a daytime link now lost) and even between Warrington and St Helens.

I never did understand why when Fairway went out of business nobody wanted 339 service considering how busy it used to be

The 329 still keeps a link between Warrington and Burtonwood however not via Gemini which is what made the service different, it was a new link between Gemini and St Helens too that is lost.

[Mayneway]

RE: Services which don't exist but there could be demand for

(16/09/2015 20:51)Dentonian Wrote:  Presumably, 236/7 would not work due to Metrolink. S50 failed simply because the Operator didn't register (or deregister) the service properly - same goes for S48.....and AFAIK, the S49 STILL hasn't been deregistered, and consequently, their services could not be promoted properly.
Extended 201s back into Glossop probably wouldn't work as the journey would simply be too long. As mentioned earlier the 201 is slow and unpunctual as it is, with the 7 mile section from Hyde to Manchester typically taking 45 minutes off-peak

I know you have some ill feeling towards the operator but I always liked the idea. It should have worked better than it did. A culmination of events led to it's downfall, yes some down to the operator some by other parties but you cannot fault his promotion of the service.

Slightly off topic perhaps but what route did the 201 take into Glossop and what route did it take into Ashton? ( I have many photos of stagecoach Tridents and B10Ms from 2000-2003 on 201s in Ashton with destinations set to hattersely).

[knutstransport]

RE: Services which don't exist but there could be demand for

(16/09/2015 13:54)wirralbus Wrote:  In this day and age most routes that will be commercially viable are in operation , some commercially viable routes could be joined together , remember the days in Merseybus times when routes where joined together may be an idea.

I personally think there's a gap in the market.

If a route exists and either no-one uses a certain section or something major opens just off the bus route then the bus route gets revised.

If no-one uses a route and withdrawing it doesn't leave anywhere cut off then it does get withdrawn.

However, if potential demand for a new route exists then the new route rarely gets introduced.