Lancashire Triangle Electrification

[wirralbus]

RE: Lancashire Triangle Electrification
Good to see that they are now dealing with the line from St Helens to Huyton , it wont be long before we can say bye bye to the pacers and sprinters and say hello Emu's .

[DVG526]

RE: Lancashire Triangle Electrification

(17/10/2013 18:25)wirralbus Wrote:  Good to see that they are now dealing with the line from St Helens to Huyton , it wont be long before we can say bye bye to the pacers and sprinters and say hello Emu's .

EMUs that are the same age as the DMUs they are replacing..

[childwallblues]

RE: Lancashire Triangle Electrification

(20/10/2013 09:23)DVG526 Wrote:  

(17/10/2013 18:25)wirralbus Wrote:  Good to see that they are now dealing with the line from St Helens to Huyton , it wont be long before we can say bye bye to the pacers and sprinters and say hello Emu's .

EMUs that are the same age as the DMUs they are replacing..

Does it matter? The 319s are excellent units and will be fully refurbished

[First Class]

RE: Lancashire Triangle Electrification

(20/10/2013 17:37)childwallblues Wrote:  

(20/10/2013 09:23)DVG526 Wrote:  

(17/10/2013 18:25)wirralbus Wrote:  Good to see that they are now dealing with the line from St Helens to Huyton , it wont be long before we can say bye bye to the pacers and sprinters and say hello Emu's .

EMUs that are the same age as the DMUs they are replacing..

Does it matter? The 319s are excellent units and will be fully refurbished

Life expectancy of EMUs built around that time is ~40 years.

So they are likely to be with us until 2030ish - do you really think the Class 319 will be appropriate in 10 or 20 more years, even with a refurbishment?

I don't really have a problem with the units themselves, BUT:

One of the core "refurbishment" plans was to remove one of the intermediate vehicles, reducing capacity to 3 coaches, primarily because DfT/Network Rail didn't want to pay for any platform extensions for multiple working.

With major enhancements like "Northern Hub", electrification, even HS2 etc, I suspect demand will absolutely rocket and whilst we might get to our destination a little quicker, I suspect it is going to be more than a little cosy in there!

[wirralbus]

RE: Lancashire Triangle Electrification
Four car units may save having a capacity problem in the future , nothing better than future proofing the system now than in the future when all the resources for possible platform extensions are around now .

[DVG526]

RE: Lancashire Triangle Electrification

(20/10/2013 17:37)childwallblues Wrote:  

(20/10/2013 09:23)DVG526 Wrote:  

(17/10/2013 18:25)wirralbus Wrote:  Good to see that they are now dealing with the line from St Helens to Huyton , it wont be long before we can say bye bye to the pacers and sprinters and say hello Emu's .

EMUs that are the same age as the DMUs they are replacing..

Does it matter? The 319s are excellent units and will be fully refurbished

How extensive the 'refurbishment' is remains to be seen. And yes it does matter. Once again the poor relation in the North are being fobbed off with inferior worn out trains for a well patronised service between 2 major cities, units which despite a lick of paint will soon show their age. A 319 is no better than a 150, no matter how much you tart it up. Then we have this story about them being downgraded to 3 cars, haven't we seen that before around here?

[First Class]

RE: Lancashire Triangle Electrification
To be fair, as long as they remain 4 or 8 car sets, I don't really mind, considering Porterbrook, the ROSCO is proposing some pretty dramatic changes.

(Unfourtunately, however, the brochure has detailed considerations for modification to 3-cars)

http://www.porterbrook.com/downloads/bro...ochure.pdf

Despite the government spin, I doubt these units will get sealed windows and airconditioning installed as was suggested. Quite simply the auxiliary systems cannot support the power requirements, and installing new electrical packages, (not to mention the AC units themselves), will be financially prohibitive. This would probably also prevent plug sockets and wifi.
Even Porterbrook admit that only "basic air cooling" could be provided, and even then, would still need the electrical system to be replaced.

I also think it is stupid to limit these units to 75mph (page 15), when with they are currently capable of 100mph.

[wirralbus]

RE: Lancashire Triangle Electrification
How often do we see four car 156 operation in the Liverpool area on local services ?

Just been checking and these Class 319 units are shorter than the Class 156 units , if these electric units cause an upsurge in traffic some flows are going suffer.

[507022]

RE: Lancashire Triangle Electrification

(22/10/2013 12:18)wirralbus Wrote:  How often do we see four car 156 operation in the Liverpool area on local services ?

Just been checking and these Class 319 units are shorter than the Class 156 units , if these electric units cause an upsurge in traffic some flows are going suffer.

Aren't these EMUs going to work Liverpool to Wigan & Manchester?
If only 10 are coming up north as has been mentioned here previously, then there's hardly going to be enough for too much multiple working anyway.
The only 4 cars on these lines at the moment seem to be at peak times, and not too many of them, and 6 cars are unheard of!
4 cars should suffice, particularly as most journeys made now seem to be short, local ones.
However all this obviously depends on the frequency of the new electric services

[childwallblues]

RE: Lancashire Triangle Electrification

(22/10/2013 15:44)507022 Wrote:  

(22/10/2013 12:18)wirralbus Wrote:  How often do we see four car 156 operation in the Liverpool area on local services ?

Just been checking and these Class 319 units are shorter than the Class 156 units , if these electric units cause an upsurge in traffic some flows are going suffer.

Aren't these EMUs going to work Liverpool to Wigan & Manchester?
If only 10 are coming up north as has been mentioned here previously, then there's hardly going to be enough for too much multiple working anyway.
The only 4 cars on these lines at the moment seem to be at peak times, and not too many of them, and 6 cars are unheard of!
4 cars should suffice, particularly as most journeys made now seem to be short, local ones.
However all this obviously depends on the frequency of the new electric services

There are 86 x 4 car Class 319 units. As far as I was aware the original intention was to send the standard class only units (319361-86) north but that may have changed. The electrification from Manchester to Leeds/York/Selby may see many more appear. Also there will be 41 Class 365 going spare when Peterborough/Kings Lynn to King Cross becomes part of Thameslink.
319s are shorter than 156s (20m as opposed to 23m).