Forum | Merseyside Dennis Dart Website
Stagecoach MCSL - Chester & Wirral Depots - Printable Version

+- Forum | Merseyside Dennis Dart Website (http://dartslf.com/forum)
+-- Forum: Buses (/forumdisplay.php?fid=1)
+--- Forum: Local Bus Scene: North West and Wales (/forumdisplay.php?fid=2)
+--- Thread: Stagecoach MCSL - Chester & Wirral Depots (/showthread.php?tid=1427)

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360 361 362 363 364 365 366 367 368 369 370 371 372 373 374 375 376 377 378 379 380 381 382 383 384 385 386 387 388 389 390 391 392 393 394 395 396 397 398 399 400 401 402 403 404 405 406 407 408 409 410 411 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 423 424 425 426 427 428 429 430 431 432 433 434 435 436 437 438 439 440 441 442 443 444 445 446 447 448 449 450 451 452 453 454 455 456 457 458 459 460 461 462 463 464 465 466 467 468 469 470 471 472 473 474 475 476 477 478 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 526 527 528 529 530 531 532 533 534 535 536 537 538 539 540 541 542 543 544 545 546 547 548 549 550 551 552 553 554 555 556 557 558 559 560 561 562 563 564 565 566 567 568 569 570 571 572 573 574 575 576 577 578 579 580 581 582 583 584 585 586 587 588 589 590 591 592 593 594 595 596 597 598 599 600 601 602 603 604 605 606 607 608 609 610 611 612 613 614 615 616 617 618 619 620 621 622 623 624 625 626 627 628 629 630 631 632 633 634 635 636 637 638 639 640 641 642 643 644 645 646 647 648 649 650 651 652 653 654 655 656 657 658 659 660 661 662 663 664 665 666 667 668 669 670 671 672 673 674 675 676 677 678 679 680 681 682 683 684 685 686 687 688 689 690 691 692 693 694 695 696 697 698 699 700 701 702 703 704 705 706 707 708 709 710 711 712 713 714 715 716 717 718 719 720 721 722 723 724 725 726 727 728 729 730 731 732 733 734 735 736 737 738 739 740 741 742 743 744 745 746 747 748 749 750 751 752 753 754 755 756 757 758 759 760 761 762 763 764 765 766 767 768 769 770 771 772 773 774 775 776 777 778 779 780 781 782 783 784 785 786 787 788 789 790 791 792 793 794 795 796 797 798 799 800 801 802 803 804 805 806 807 808 809 810 811 812 813 814 815 816 817 818 819 820 821 822 823 824 825 826 827 828 829 830 831 832 833 834 835 836 837 838 839 840 841 842 843 844 845 846 847 848 849 850 851 852 853 854 855 856 857 858 859 860 861 862 863 864 865 866 867 868 869 870 871 872 873 874 875 876 877 878 879 880


RE: Stagecoach Chester & Wirral - wirralbus - 10/11/2017 17:12

The X2 is the proof that the Chester - Ellesmere port corridor will always be the cash cow for Stagecoach.

Ellesmere Port - Liverpool has a lot more competition on it from the railway admittedly the Ellesmere Port - Liverpool railway line has suffered recently from having to change over trains at Hooton which had been a minus mark for the trains .


RE: Stagecoach Chester & Wirral - chester285 - 10/11/2017 17:32

(10/11/2017 13:57)wirralbus Wrote:  The 1 and 2 will always be busy at the Chester end of the route because there is no direct link otherwise with Ellesmere Port , after Ellesmere Port on all the liverpool service a single decker most of the times is under 50% certaintly not a double deck load , maybe with the exception of the Cheshire Oaks peak loads which the depot will know of from previous years.

Have chester the spare capacity for the passengers in Mill lane , Bache .

One change of route at one depot has repercussions at the other depot.

Does the X2 not count in that, that’s more direct than the one and 2


RE: Stagecoach Chester & Wirral - chester285 - 10/11/2017 17:37

(10/11/2017 11:26)SSS871 Wrote:  Vanity project or not, it shows how far the garage has come since First ownership. Investment in vehicles and lower fares have led to increased passenger numbers and route innovation/new routes as a result - its not rocket science.

That said, I do miss the variety you used to get with the old Rock Ferry.

Unlike Chester where the only new vehicles were for the park and rides, for a time they had the 5 200mmcs which have since left the area, I do think making Rockferry all gold would lose the attraction of gold standard vehicles


RE: Stagecoach Chester & Wirral - wirralbus - 10/11/2017 17:48

(10/11/2017 17:37)chester285 Wrote:  Unlike Chester where the only new vehicles were for the park and rides, for a time they had the 5 200mmcs which have since left the area, I do think making Rockferry all gold would lose the attraction of gold standard as it would just be the norm.

I have to agree there is more that can be done at Chester first.

Gold standard should be for the routes with the highest earning potential for Stagecoach , dont dilute the brand by placing it on every route .

I agree with it being put on the 471/2 but that is now where the Gold brand should end its day for the time being , more money should be put into standard vehicles .


RE: Stagecoach Chester & Wirral - chester285 - 10/11/2017 18:01

(10/11/2017 17:48)wirralbus Wrote:  I have to agree there is more that can be done at Chester first.

Gold standard should be for the routes with the highest earning potential for Stagecoach , dont dilute the brand by placing it on every route .

I agree with it being put on the 471/2 but that is now where the Gold brand should end its day for the time being , more money should be put into standard vehicles .

I am surprised that hey haven’t made the blacons gold standard, I suppose the investment in chester will be the brand new depot if and when that happens


RE: Stagecoach Chester & Wirral - iMarkeh - 11/11/2017 14:22

(10/11/2017 17:48)wirralbus Wrote:  I have to agree there is more that can be done at Chester first.

Gold standard should be for the routes with the highest earning potential for Stagecoach , dont dilute the brand by placing it on every route .

I agree with it being put on the 471/2 but that is now where the Gold brand should end its day for the time being , more money should be put into standard vehicles .

Not a lot can be done in Chester. There are places wanting more service but Stagecoach in Chester is completely stuck. They are locked in every way by Arriva. Expand on a fast route to Runcorn, X30. Want to head south of the city, Wrexham 1. West 3,4,10,11,12. North is the only way they can expand and the options are literally just the 22 which they tried and tested. Anywhere Stagecoach could go, Arriva already operate. They have said if Stagecoach go on the 10s to expand along Sealand Road, they will go in competition on the 16. They can't and wont win expanding in Chester unless they get tenders (DB1/2 & 4 are up next month which I reacon Stagecoach will get). Rob Jones is very close with John Cherry (Helms) so wouldn't go in competition towards Waverton or CRL.
All other areas make no money really.

Going off what you say about Stagecoach Gold, the 1, 2 are obviously big money for Stagecoach. As is the 41/42 (It wouldnt be so frequent otherwise). Only the 38 which has a 30 min frequency. All other routes are very regular and must have a lot of money in them. If the 1, 2, 41, 42 all go up, all the vehicles will venture onto the 38 regardless of its GOLD status so it might as well be promoted too. That would leave the 6 (Which I think should move to chester especially when the new depot opens), schools (gold is useless) and the contract routes.

(10/11/2017 18:01)chester285 Wrote:  I am surprised that hey haven’t made the blacons gold standard, I suppose the investment in chester will be the brand new depot if and when that happens

Blacons.... Gold.... I don't think that will happen anytime soon. The Blacon buses get battered enough without them being new. The Eclipse are good workhorses and can be used on any route despite their primary allocation. Good buses, reasonable capacity, good for passengers due to their leg room (I find darts can be a little tight as can some Solos), also very comfy. I don't think any new bus would provide that. I think the Volvo 7900Hs would look really good in an allover Blacon type livery. It is a shame Stagecoach only buy ADL... Gold I don't think will be in Chester depot any more than current. The 5 was only done because Rob Jones lives along the route. Route 7 & 9 all used the same vehicles at the time (7 & 9 interworked with the 5 I think at some point). I don't think GOLD will have a place in Chester. It doesn't make much difference here. Arriva Saphire all go out of town. No local route gets upgraded really. It is all the longer distance. Chester - Connahs Quay (all revenue is Connahs Quay - Garden city into Chester. Sealand road does nothing for it). Chester - Wrexham (All revenue is Wrexham - Posthouse Roundabout into and out of Chester. Business Park I think is valuable but not a mega money area). Nothing local works to be upgraded really. The average passenger must be on the bus for at least 20 minutes to get any benefit of a premium brand.


RE: Stagecoach Chester & Wirral - Olympian2100 - 11/11/2017 16:24

(11/11/2017 14:22)iMarkeh Wrote:  Not a lot can be done in Chester. There are places wanting more service but Stagecoach in Chester is completely stuck. They are locked in every way by Arriva. Expand on a fast route to Runcorn, X30. Want to head south of the city, Wrexham 1. West 3,4,10,11,12. North is the only way they can expand and the options are literally just the 22 which they tried and tested. Anywhere Stagecoach could go, Arriva already operate. They have said if Stagecoach go on the 10s to expand along Sealand Road, they will go in competition on the 16. They can't and wont win expanding in Chester unless they get tenders (DB1/2 & 4 are up next month which I reacon Stagecoach will get). Rob Jones is very close with John Cherry (Helms) so wouldn't go in competition towards Waverton or CRL.
All other areas make no money really.

Going off what you say about Stagecoach Gold, the 1, 2 are obviously big money for Stagecoach. As is the 41/42 (It wouldnt be so frequent otherwise). Only the 38 which has a 30 min frequency. All other routes are very regular and must have a lot of money in them. If the 1, 2, 41, 42 all go up, all the vehicles will venture onto the 38 regardless of its GOLD status so it might as well be promoted too. That would leave the 6 (Which I think should move to chester especially when the new depot opens), schools (gold is useless) and the contract routes.


Blacons.... Gold.... I don't think that will happen anytime soon. The Blacon buses get battered enough without them being new. The Eclipse are good workhorses and can be used on any route despite their primary allocation. Good buses, reasonable capacity, good for passengers due to their leg room (I find darts can be a little tight as can some Solos), also very comfy. I don't think any new bus would provide that. I think the Volvo 7900Hs would look really good in an allover Blacon type livery. It is a shame Stagecoach only buy ADL... Gold I don't think will be in Chester depot any more than current. The 5 was only done because Rob Jones lives along the route. Route 7 & 9 all used the same vehicles at the time (7 & 9 interworked with the 5 I think at some point). I don't think GOLD will have a place in Chester. It doesn't make much difference here. Arriva Saphire all go out of town. No local route gets upgraded really. It is all the longer distance. Chester - Connahs Quay (all revenue is Connahs Quay - Garden city into Chester. Sealand road does nothing for it). Chester - Wrexham (All revenue is Wrexham - Posthouse Roundabout into and out of Chester. Business Park I think is valuable but not a mega money area). Nothing local works to be upgraded really. The average passenger must be on the bus for at least 20 minutes to get any benefit of a premium brand.

The only reason Stagecoach buy ADL vehicles is due to Brian Souter having a large stake in them.


RE: Stagecoach Chester & Wirral - childwallblues - 11/11/2017 21:33

I did not realise that 10835 was still at Chester. It was on the X8 today.


RE: Stagecoach Chester & Wirral - gka472l - 11/11/2017 22:13

(11/11/2017 21:33)childwallblues Wrote:  I did not realise that 10835 was still at Chester. It was on the X8 today.

All four still there, 10828/30/31/35, saw all of them on the X8 yesterday, along with a 19*** Enviro400 and an Enviro300, Stevel Knight Media reported a few days ago that the four Enviro400's recently up from Devon are to be branded for the X8, presume the MMC's will go to Gillmoss then?


RE: Stagecoach Chester & Wirral - mtl97 - 11/11/2017 23:41

They have said if Stagecoach go on the 10s to expand along Sealand Road, they will go in competition on the 16. They can't and wont win expanding in Chester unless they get tenders (DB1/2 & 4 are up next month which I reacon Stagecoach will get)

Arriva are not as strong as they were, around 2007 they ran buses on nearly every route out of chester, Liverpool 401/x11, west kirby 421/422, runcorn 21/x30, northwich 82, winsford 230,x20, Crewe 84 & the wales routes including x94 to barmouth, since then arriva have abandoned routes to the wirral, halved frequency on runcorn & Crewe routes, only back on northwich route & now on db routes due to the collapse of gha, stagecoach only problem is land for buses to park on but that is being sorted out, if stagecoach end up on any arriva routes it will because arriva dont want it anymore, stagecoach have got what they want in chester anyway, park & rides, e port routes & cheshire oaks to themselves