Forum | Merseyside Dennis Dart Website

Just been having a look through Gillmoss Titans Flickr, couldnt help but notice how many vehicles that they lost to fires. Quite incredible really.

Quite a few were also lost in low bridge accidents the most notable one being 2333 KYV333X which had its accident only just a few days after it was repainted in to the then new GTL allover red livery think this was also the first bus in the entire GTL fleet to be painted red.

Yes there was a few that went that way as well, looks like dodgy Maintenance standards and the odd dodgy driver as well. Good job that stagecoach stepped in when they did as you wonder what the standards would have been now.

Some of Karl Suttons photos have appeared on other flickr members sites without direct permission to do so also!

And people wonder why Gilmoss don't use deckers! half of the pictures explain why

It's surprising Souter took on GTL. He tells the story of doing a anonymous recky trip on a GTL bus before Stagecoach took them over, and of the driver fiddling the fares. Apparently, it was rife.

You knew they were in trouble when more time-expired Titans arrived - they hadn't been through the refurbishment that the MTL examples had recieved ten years earlier. The Alexander B6s weren't that bad, but this was stuff that Stagecoach themselves had gotten shut of.

The only thing going for GTL was the quality of the ex-CMT fleet, and it's telling that the only ex-GTL buses still operating with Stagecoach Merseyside are the CMT examples.

I wonder if the Grants regret selling CMT to Glenvale?

What kept GTL going was the CC's ruling that Arriva couldn't go near them for the first three years. It's still an odd state of affairs when Arriva have very little commercial activity in the Kirkby area. Me wonders why?

Think there was some sort of agreement between Stagecoach and Arriva that arriva wouldnt go to Kirkby if stagecoach didnt go to one of an Arriva stronghold, possibly Speke but don't know for certain and that's is a guess. I'm sure that there will be other forum members more clued up on this. As for ex CMT buses, the only ex CMT buses that are still in service are the SPD'S, the BL's & BLE'S were withdrawn a month or two ago along with the remaining crusaders.

My last ever Titan ride was with GTL, on 10 August 2002. My final London example had been on 8 November 1999, coincidentally from Catford which now shares common ownership with GTL as part of Stagecoach.

You kind of felt extreme sympathy with the staff at Gillmoss because they went through three different owners in less than 18 months - MTL, Arriva North West, then GTL - and this probably did nothing for staff morale. The salt in the wound came when the R-reg Olympians would not be staying with GTL due to them not being able to afford the lease payments. Imagine being at GM when those beyond-the-grave Metrobuses from London began arriving as replacements.

I saw a couple at Gillmoss not long after they got to Liverpool. They were repainted in MTL/GTL red and cream and looked quite good - from a distance. They actually had "Arriva Merseyside" legal lettering but never saw service with Arriva.

I went on one working a 17 to Fazakerley one day in August 2001. Impressions? Bouncy and slow - despite having a screaming Gardner engine. Not pleasant.

Those metrobuses were shocking, painted blue inside with full Arriva seats. 20 years old when they came as well, then we got equally ancient unrefurbished titans as well.

When you think about it, within 5 years Gillmoss seen 5 different identities - shows how much turmoil there still was in the bus industry even in the early 2000's.

I remember the Metrobuses - the middle door conversion job appeared to have been done in a very tacky way (and that's putting it mildly). On a par with some of Arriva's Pathfinders.